Because I'm already irritated -- the Brothers Grimm
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Aug. 28th, 2005 | 12:02 pm
My review:
Go rent The Adventures of Baron Munchasen instead.
***********************
That's not a review.
It is so a review.
No, it's not. You have readers now. Not many of them, I admit, but all two of them want an actual review. They want to know what you thought about the movie.
***********************
The Brothers Grimm: A Review.
Go rent The Fisher King, which also has Robin Williams in it.
***********************
Do you not get the concept of review?
Um.
Hmm.
Yes. I do. And that was my review.
Listen. A review's gotta have a couple of things in it. It's gotta mention if you liked the movie or not. The movie's flaws. The movie's good points --
Good points?
Every film has its good points.
Were you watching Dungeons and Dragons?
Even that film had its good points.
Name one.
It ended.
Ok. The Brothers Grimm ended.
We already knew that.
Trust me. At various times during this film we were all wondering if this film would ever, ever end. So, I am now not only giving a review, I'm providing useful information.
Try again.
*************************
The Brothers Grimm: A review
People keep licking toads in this movie. Let's talk about that for a moment. Thing is, toads, even toads not from the exotic island of Madasgascar or the vibrant rain forests of Costa Rica, are nasty. They taste bad. They taste terrible. The reason for this is that toads, and more specifically the bacteria on the toads, are constantly secreting toxins that cover the skin of the toad to keep you and other predators from eating or licking the toad. Many of these toxins are alkaloids that will kill you, so if you are running around licking toads, which you shouldn't be doing anyway since in the very vague explanation that serves for plot in the film you are supposed to be saving young children, not licking them or their toads, you would most probably stop licking the toad as soon as you tasted it or keel over dead or perhaps imagine very odd things, like living in a world where people insist on only filming intelligent scripts.
*************************
In a long, long history of film criticism several chapters have been undoubtedly devoted to the rule that film reviews should not include long and generally useless diversions about alkaloids on toad skins that were never once mentioned in the movie.
It would have been a better movie if they had talked about this.
Undoubtedly, but here's a thought: try reviewing the film and not discussing toads?
************************
The Brothers Grimm: A review.
Brazil is a dazzling set piece, a mass of confusion and visual works that simultaneously draws you in and repels you and makes you wonder what the hell is going on and if Gilliam's visionary creativity can ever actually be captured on film giving the limitations of film back in the 1980s and even today.
The Brothers Grimm doesn't do any of that.
************************
There.
You can't just review a movie by making constant comparisons to the director's earlier work. In fact, any review that just rests on comparisons to earlier films is total crap. It's awful. It's wrong. It isn't a review.
You're not doing much for my self-esteem here.
I'm telling you to write the review.
I hate to tell you this, but those two readers you mentioned a short while back? They've already fled, since they're the sorts that get easily irritated by this type of meta-critical dialogue that allows us to pretend that we are delighted to be working within the tropes of post-modernism or just trying to be a bit clever. That, or they didn't like the part about the toad licking.
Then it doesn't matter if this review's any good or not, does it?
*************************
So I'm sitting at The Brothers Grimm last night with a couple of friends heartened by the film's one clear good point -- it was being shown in a nice, air-conditioned theatre -- and getting mildly concerned by the previews, which were uniformly awful with the exception of the preview for some horrible film called Emily Rose, which added vaguely nauseating to awful, and sipping some Coke so that the caffeine would allow me to, you know, focus on the film, which I was starting to think would not be a good idea, when the film started, and I realized that indeed, Coke was not the appropriate product for this film. Valium, sure. Tylenol PM, even better.
It's a mess.
(It also, as an aside, has pretty much nothing to do with the movie poster, which leads me to think that what actually happened was that the marketing department took a look at this film and had just no idea what the hell to do with it and gave up in utter despair and created a poster with two good looking guys on it. Which has its points.)
The mess begins with a script that, even by the standards of Terry Gilliam films, makes no sense. Yes, even less sense than the end of Time Bandits. It continues with poor direction, poor editing, truly horrible special effects (and, general word to the wise: do not, but do not, put a single werewolf in any film released post Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban unless you have close to that film's budget, because otherwise, your audience will be drawing comparisons between the two werewolves, and it will not be to your advantage) and actors unsure of both their characters and their characters' accents. The tone, too, is uncertain, lurching between farce to action/adventure to horror, with the audience pretty much laughing only at the horror parts. The film also tries to reference, cleverly, various Grimm fairy tales for no particular purpose, which would have worked better had the film stuck to using only Grimm's fairy tales, and not also including various tales from Anderson. For some unknown reason the Gingerbread Man also makes a very unfortunate appearance which had the audience in stitches, and not for the right reasons.
Perhaps faced with the realization that their characters really won't make sense, no matter what they try to do, the actors, with the exception of Heath Ledger, pretty much give up entirely and instead entertain themselves by flipping through various accents. Matt Damon looks very very bored, which works in the first half the film but is slightly disorienting in the parts where he really shouldn't be bored because things are attacking him, and jumps between an odd British accent, something that sounded mildly Hungarian, and then pure American. Peter Stomare, clearly, took one look at the script, shrugged, gave up and started capering around and jumping between French and Italian accents. His performance is mildly amusing but makes no sense. The girl in the film has nice cleavage.
At a certain point, too, we have to wonder why, exactly, Gilliam cannot let a movie slide without inserting a torture scene, or, in this case, having had one torture scene, for no particular reason interrupt the film to have a second torture scene that makes absolutely no sense plotwise or otherwise, and also has a strange and frankly unconvincing bit with a kitten. (And when a kitten isn't convincing, you know you have a problem.)
Gilliam, as always, is fascinated by the line between the rational and irrational, between reality and dreams, and his thought - that the rational can never fully repress the irrational, and that perhaps reality is actually composed of dreams, not reality -- is one that usually makes his films breathtaking or annoying or provoking or, most importantly, watchable. But in this case, neither his rational or irritational halves have created anything that makes the slightest bit of sense. And it's a pity, because a few scenes here and there suggest that The Brothers Grimm could have worked as a horror film, or as a fantasy film, or as a comedy. But as it is, it fails on all levels.
**********************
Thanks.
I really think I should have just stuck to the toads.
Go rent The Adventures of Baron Munchasen instead.
***********************
That's not a review.
It is so a review.
No, it's not. You have readers now. Not many of them, I admit, but all two of them want an actual review. They want to know what you thought about the movie.
***********************
The Brothers Grimm: A Review.
Go rent The Fisher King, which also has Robin Williams in it.
***********************
Do you not get the concept of review?
Um.
Hmm.
Yes. I do. And that was my review.
Listen. A review's gotta have a couple of things in it. It's gotta mention if you liked the movie or not. The movie's flaws. The movie's good points --
Good points?
Every film has its good points.
Were you watching Dungeons and Dragons?
Even that film had its good points.
Name one.
It ended.
Ok. The Brothers Grimm ended.
We already knew that.
Trust me. At various times during this film we were all wondering if this film would ever, ever end. So, I am now not only giving a review, I'm providing useful information.
Try again.
*************************
The Brothers Grimm: A review
People keep licking toads in this movie. Let's talk about that for a moment. Thing is, toads, even toads not from the exotic island of Madasgascar or the vibrant rain forests of Costa Rica, are nasty. They taste bad. They taste terrible. The reason for this is that toads, and more specifically the bacteria on the toads, are constantly secreting toxins that cover the skin of the toad to keep you and other predators from eating or licking the toad. Many of these toxins are alkaloids that will kill you, so if you are running around licking toads, which you shouldn't be doing anyway since in the very vague explanation that serves for plot in the film you are supposed to be saving young children, not licking them or their toads, you would most probably stop licking the toad as soon as you tasted it or keel over dead or perhaps imagine very odd things, like living in a world where people insist on only filming intelligent scripts.
*************************
In a long, long history of film criticism several chapters have been undoubtedly devoted to the rule that film reviews should not include long and generally useless diversions about alkaloids on toad skins that were never once mentioned in the movie.
It would have been a better movie if they had talked about this.
Undoubtedly, but here's a thought: try reviewing the film and not discussing toads?
************************
The Brothers Grimm: A review.
Brazil is a dazzling set piece, a mass of confusion and visual works that simultaneously draws you in and repels you and makes you wonder what the hell is going on and if Gilliam's visionary creativity can ever actually be captured on film giving the limitations of film back in the 1980s and even today.
The Brothers Grimm doesn't do any of that.
************************
There.
You can't just review a movie by making constant comparisons to the director's earlier work. In fact, any review that just rests on comparisons to earlier films is total crap. It's awful. It's wrong. It isn't a review.
You're not doing much for my self-esteem here.
I'm telling you to write the review.
I hate to tell you this, but those two readers you mentioned a short while back? They've already fled, since they're the sorts that get easily irritated by this type of meta-critical dialogue that allows us to pretend that we are delighted to be working within the tropes of post-modernism or just trying to be a bit clever. That, or they didn't like the part about the toad licking.
Then it doesn't matter if this review's any good or not, does it?
*************************
So I'm sitting at The Brothers Grimm last night with a couple of friends heartened by the film's one clear good point -- it was being shown in a nice, air-conditioned theatre -- and getting mildly concerned by the previews, which were uniformly awful with the exception of the preview for some horrible film called Emily Rose, which added vaguely nauseating to awful, and sipping some Coke so that the caffeine would allow me to, you know, focus on the film, which I was starting to think would not be a good idea, when the film started, and I realized that indeed, Coke was not the appropriate product for this film. Valium, sure. Tylenol PM, even better.
It's a mess.
(It also, as an aside, has pretty much nothing to do with the movie poster, which leads me to think that what actually happened was that the marketing department took a look at this film and had just no idea what the hell to do with it and gave up in utter despair and created a poster with two good looking guys on it. Which has its points.)
The mess begins with a script that, even by the standards of Terry Gilliam films, makes no sense. Yes, even less sense than the end of Time Bandits. It continues with poor direction, poor editing, truly horrible special effects (and, general word to the wise: do not, but do not, put a single werewolf in any film released post Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban unless you have close to that film's budget, because otherwise, your audience will be drawing comparisons between the two werewolves, and it will not be to your advantage) and actors unsure of both their characters and their characters' accents. The tone, too, is uncertain, lurching between farce to action/adventure to horror, with the audience pretty much laughing only at the horror parts. The film also tries to reference, cleverly, various Grimm fairy tales for no particular purpose, which would have worked better had the film stuck to using only Grimm's fairy tales, and not also including various tales from Anderson. For some unknown reason the Gingerbread Man also makes a very unfortunate appearance which had the audience in stitches, and not for the right reasons.
Perhaps faced with the realization that their characters really won't make sense, no matter what they try to do, the actors, with the exception of Heath Ledger, pretty much give up entirely and instead entertain themselves by flipping through various accents. Matt Damon looks very very bored, which works in the first half the film but is slightly disorienting in the parts where he really shouldn't be bored because things are attacking him, and jumps between an odd British accent, something that sounded mildly Hungarian, and then pure American. Peter Stomare, clearly, took one look at the script, shrugged, gave up and started capering around and jumping between French and Italian accents. His performance is mildly amusing but makes no sense. The girl in the film has nice cleavage.
At a certain point, too, we have to wonder why, exactly, Gilliam cannot let a movie slide without inserting a torture scene, or, in this case, having had one torture scene, for no particular reason interrupt the film to have a second torture scene that makes absolutely no sense plotwise or otherwise, and also has a strange and frankly unconvincing bit with a kitten. (And when a kitten isn't convincing, you know you have a problem.)
Gilliam, as always, is fascinated by the line between the rational and irrational, between reality and dreams, and his thought - that the rational can never fully repress the irrational, and that perhaps reality is actually composed of dreams, not reality -- is one that usually makes his films breathtaking or annoying or provoking or, most importantly, watchable. But in this case, neither his rational or irritational halves have created anything that makes the slightest bit of sense. And it's a pity, because a few scenes here and there suggest that The Brothers Grimm could have worked as a horror film, or as a fantasy film, or as a comedy. But as it is, it fails on all levels.
**********************
Thanks.
I really think I should have just stuck to the toads.

(no subject)
from:
leex
date: Aug. 28th, 2005 06:15 pm (UTC)
Link
I'd ask you to review The Isle if I didn't, you know, value your respect, friendship and/or will to live. : X
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from:
mariness
date: Aug. 28th, 2005 08:12 pm (UTC)
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from:
disi
date: Aug. 28th, 2005 06:32 pm (UTC)
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(no subject)
from:
mariness
date: Aug. 28th, 2005 08:13 pm (UTC)
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from:
athenakt
date: Aug. 28th, 2005 08:14 pm (UTC)
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Hey, who was getting tortured during the torture scenes? Was it picturesque or just silly?
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from:
mariness
date: Aug. 29th, 2005 01:03 am (UTC)
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from:
queerbychoice
date: Aug. 28th, 2005 09:41 pm (UTC)
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from:
mariness
date: Aug. 29th, 2005 01:07 am (UTC)
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And I usually assume that you skip over my movie reviews, given your general lack of interest in films. In fact, I'm surprised you made it all the way to the toad licking part.
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(no subject)
from:
simplykathryn
date: Aug. 29th, 2005 03:00 am (UTC)
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(no subject)
from:
mariness
date: Aug. 29th, 2005 02:15 pm (UTC)
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Licking Bufo Marinus
from:
coldecho
date: Aug. 29th, 2005 01:41 pm (UTC)
Link
There are cultures in the world who eat bugs and worms. I've known some friends who've eaten live Mealy Worms raised exclusively on apples (Which is another story involving Klingon reenactment clubs. The mealy worms are supposed to be Gackh - which is best when eaten live. Incidentally, the worms are supposed to taste much like apples when that's all they've been subsisting on.)
My point is merely that licking toads is not all that unusual, or unheard of. Terry Gilliam is often considered as part of that aforementioned drug culture...or at least, his creative endeavors are thought highly of by said culture groups. I am generalizing that opinion, since I only have hearsay evidence...
I haven't seen the movie. I still might. Although some Shawns consider me over-critical of films, I am not near enough to your level to prevent me from going to see it. Even if it's spectacularly dreadful, or even cheestastic!
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Re: Licking Bufo Marinus
from:
mariness
date: Aug. 29th, 2005 02:14 pm (UTC)
Link
The urban legend stems from the very real fact that some of the toxins on the skins of some toads do produce a hallucinogenic effect -- specifically, a little toxin called bufotenine. But, you can't get that effect by licking the toad, for various reasons. One, the taste really is extremely bitter, to the point where the tongue will recoil instinctively. Two, you have to do a lot of licking -- which you can't, because of the taste -- to get an effect. Three, the bufotenine on the toad won't get you high; it has to be heated to slightly modify the chemical to produce the desired effect. Once cooked, sure, hallucinate to your heart's content. And that, people have unquestionably done -- taken nice slimy stuff off a toad, cooked it up a bit and mixed it with stuff to make it palatable. In some cases, the toad is killed, the skin is dried, and then turned into tea, with a LOT OF SUGAR ADDED, for the effect. I should add that this is entirely illegal in most countries -- not so much the killing the toad part but the creating drugs part.
In some cases -- with the poison toads of Central America -- a lick will literally kill you; those toads have much heavier amounts of neurotoxins on their skin. Fortunately, you won't be able to take that lick.
The lettuce thing is a new one on me. And yes, I have seen people eat live mealy worms, but mealy worms are not covered with neurotoxins.
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Re: Licking Bufo Marinus [Vague Spoilers]
from:
coldecho
date: Aug. 30th, 2005 08:59 pm (UTC)
Link
Having said that, I want to point out that in the movie, a toad was licked twice. Only twice. The first time, the woman - as sketchy as her acting was anyway - was clearly teasing the Grimm brothers by performing a bit of "folkloric, superstitious" path-finding back to the horses. She made clear later that she had received a fine education, which is a bad editting job, since it was the only explanation of her "teasing the educated brothers." The toad thing didn't work... she found the way out by the lay of the land (in contrast to using tree placement). The second time, Matt Damon's character only licked the toad because he had been duped by her performance, which to the audience was unbelieveable anyway, into thinking the trick would work. There was no further toad-licking in the entire film.
So... I don't know why you obssessed so much about the toads, which made a very brief appearance in the film, altogether.
As for accents, I can only say "At least Kevin Costner wasn't in the film."
Alright, I can say more than that. First, Peter Stormare was playing an Italian Torturer working for the French military. When he first appeared, he was attempting to speak german, after which, he promptly maligned that language in english. (which made no sense since the english itself was supposed to be German - turned into english so the audience could understand it) I didn't catch him slipping into too much of a French accent, except when he was dealing with the French - in any other film that would have been acceptable, since one might have thought he was speaking to them IN French, and not really in English at all. Of course, his character made absolutely no sense throughout the film, and wasn't particularly funny.
Matt Damon's accent was unremarkable, but he was supposed to be speaking German. Near the beginning, when they arrived in Karlstadt, there was a confusing bit where he spoke German, then switched to French to convince the soldiers to let them in the town. It was primarily spoken in english, with some linguistic window dressing. It seemed like the script, direction, and acting, didn't really seem to care how this was approached.. Period pieces in non-english speaking areas that are made for english-speaking audiences always have this problem anyway. How do you show shifts in language, without confusing the audience or resorting to subtitles? Heath Ledger barely used any accent at all, except his natural one... maybe swapping it around with a few bits of german... hard to tell. At least Jonathan Pryce was consistent, accent-wise. Annoying, but consistent.
The inclusion of bits of fairy tales from the Brothers Grimm (and sadly, other sources) was supposed to be laying the groundwork for their tales later on... not actually be the tales themselves. All the weird little things didn't have to follow any one story, because this was supposed to predate the ones we're familiar with. I do agree that the Gingerbread Man made no sense, though.
Overall, a bad movie, poorly put together. There were times when even the camera work was abyssmal, because it outright hindered any attempt by the actors to characterize their roles. Terry Gilliam always straddles the line between comedy-farce, horror, drama, social commentary, and some sort of action-fantasy. But here, it was muddled, not straddled. They needed to reshoot scenes, sack the editor, and ...and ....Gaaa! Oh who knows!
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Re: Licking Bufo Marinus [Vague Spoilers]
from:
mariness
date: Aug. 31st, 2005 09:10 pm (UTC)
Link
And you, of all people, should know how easily I obsess about things.
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Re: Licking Bufo Marinus [Vague Spoilers]
from:
coldecho
date: Aug. 31st, 2005 11:55 pm (UTC)
Link
You're right twice, I should.
I do believe that was perhaps the longest comment I have ever posted on someone else's journal... consider it...uhh... friendly clutter?
Which is completely unlike "friendly fire."
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(no subject)
from:
laurenhat
date: Aug. 30th, 2005 08:37 pm (UTC)
Link
(Hi -- I'm here because of what
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(no subject)
from:
mariness
date: Aug. 31st, 2005 10:01 pm (UTC)
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(no subject)
from:
state_champion
date: Sep. 6th, 2005 09:41 pm (UTC)
Link
I just saw it too, and was genuinely scared of the gingerbread man.
This movie lacked a lot of what I thought it had. I wish it would have brought to life more of the Grimm tales, rather than just allude to them. I was expecting tons of references everywhere, but it wasn't to be.
Why do these types of movies always have to have romantic subplots. Sigh.
And man, poor kitten.
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(no subject)
from:
mariness
date: Sep. 7th, 2005 01:23 pm (UTC)
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